Welcome back Patrick
I will explain why Eden is Not in Northern Africa Tunisia, As i ascertain, the Biblical EDEN‘s location in Eastern Africa...
GENETICS OF MODERN HUMANS
Though my ancestors are Indigenous to North Central Africa/Tunisia Over 55,000 years ago
NOTE: Haplgroup L2a being prevalent in North-Central Africa with an Origin Date of 55,150 B.P.
Would place L2a in the Upper Paleolithic era in North Africa beginning around 50,000 years before the present (ybp),
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_Paleolithic http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mousterian_Pluvial
Modern Genetics shows All of Modern Humans Dates back 188,000 ybp in East Africa.
The Mitchondrial Eve L0 and her descendants L1, L2, L3, etc. have an East African Origin
(excerpt from making the African mtDna landscape)
The main puzzle is the almost ubiquitous Haplogroup L2a,
Which we suggest may have become”Prevalent” somewhere in
North-Central Africa { Prehistoric Central North Africa }
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistoric_Central_North_Africa
Example: Modern day Tunisia near Algeria and Libya..
Spreading both East and west along the Sahel belt ~20,000 years ago at
The peak of the Last glacial maximum (or somewhat earlier).…
We recognize, however, the Origins of these Haplogroups may be more Ancient.
(L2, for example, may be well >70,000 years old )
I belong to the Ethiopian–Nubian/Egyptian mtDna L2a1
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=385086
Click to access 43026_Doron.pdf
mtdna Chart on page 5 (click clock-counter wise to view)
Click to access MtDNA_Profile_of_West_African_Guineans.pdf
Modern Genetic Migrations Continued also to fortify my Biblical River routes
My Biblical interpretation explains the Location of the East African Rivers, similar to mtDna Migrations.
GENETICS continued…
The Nile Valley and (East) Great Rift Valley Civilizations and mtDna Migration routes.…
The White Nile respectively spills from Lake Victoria Uganda, near Kenya
and flows North-bound meeting the Blue Nile spilling from
Lake Tana in E-thi-o’pi-a.
Subsequently, the Tekeze River flows from the Eritrea and
Ethiopian Border in a North Westerly fashion, Joining the two
Rivers at the Town of Atbarah (AtBarah River) Sudan/Nub-i-a
Which then Merges with the White Nile/BlueNile via Sudan-Khartoum/Nubia.
With full Northern Continuity flowing through Egypt and the Mediteranean Sea and the Levant..
This Nile Valley route has the same migration as certain Haplogroups Mtdna such as L2a1 and
L3* and M1 from “South to North”.
These particular haplogroups also share the migrations to and from West Asia’s middle east etc.. (Southern Arabia)
L2a1, L3* and M1 have notable frequencies in Nile Valley, Ethiopia, Egypt, as well as Saudi Arabia, Yemen and Oman.
(Excerpt from krings nile valley mtdna study on Hpal site 3592 L1, L2)
The Nile River Valley has been a corridor for human migrations between Egypt and Nilotic-sub-Saharan Africa,
Dr.Matthias Krings, analyzed mtDNA variationin 224 individuals from various locations along the river.
Sequences of the first hypervariable segment (HV1) ofthe mtDNA control region and a Polymorphic
HpaI site at position 3592 allowed us to designate eachmtDNA as being of “Northern” or “Southern” Affiliation.
Proportions of northern and southern mtDNA dif-fered significantly between Egypt, Nubia, and the south-ern Sudan.
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GEOGRAPHY OF GARDEN OF EDEN:
GENESIS Chpt.2
Chapter 2 verses 8 –14
Verse 8. And the Lord planted a Garden Eastward in Eden: And there he put Man whom he had Formed
Verse 9. Out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every Tree that is Pleasant to the Sight, and Good for Food;
The Tree of life also in the midst of the Garden, and The Tree of know–ledge of Good and Evil.
BIBLICAL HYDROLOGY OF EDEN
( vs.10 And a River went out of “Eden” to the water garden and from thence it was parted. and became into four heads/parts.)
(vs. 11 the name of the first is Pi’son: that is it which compasseth the whole land of Hav’i-lah, where there is Gold.
“Havilah” (literally meaning “stretch of sand”) is the name of various lands and/or people mentioned in the Bible.
I believe that Havilah could be part of the modern day
{eastern “stretch of sand” sahel regions}…
Sudan-Nubia/ and Sahel (Eritrea) and (aksum/axumite regions)…
{In Ancient Hieroglyphics the word “Nub” means Gold< and the Word Nubia means Land of Gold}
From then on, the Romans referred to the area as the Nobatae.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11147a.htm
“Hav’i-lah where there is Gold” in Ancient Cush’s Land of Ham…
(vs.12 And the the Gold of that Land is Good: there is Bdellium and the Onyx Stone)..
{Bdellium is an “Aromatic” gum like Myrrh that is exuded from Trees}
(Used for incense, as well as to Embalm the dead in Ancient Egyptian times..),
{These “Particular Trees” are also “Native” to the Horn of Africa} (commiphora myrrha)
{Onyx was used/traded in Egypt as early as the 2nd Dynasty From
Nubia/Ethiopia to make bowls and other pottery items.}
(vs.13 And the name of the second River is Gi’hon: the same is it that compasseth the Whole Land of
E-thi-o’pi-a.)
{ I believe this Biblical Hydrology mimics the White-Nile/Pi’son and Blue-Nile/Gi’hon }
Vs.14 Hid’de-kel: that is it which goes toward the East of Assyria, and the 4th river is Eu-phra’tes,
(Note: Vs.14 describes the Mesopotamia location of the Tigris River and the Euphrates going out of Eden, Northerly
Then Easterly towards Assyria– Iraq/Mesopotamia)..
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LINGUISTICS
NOTE: The Afro-Asiatic languages, which include SEMITIC languages such as ARABIC and HEBREW, are believed by Scholars to have Originated in ETHIOPIA.
The Linguistic Reconstructions of Semitic vocabulary, related to Farming and Agriculture, have supported the theory that the
origin of Semitic languages is in the Near East (Diakonoff 1988; Militarev 2003).
On the other hand, the finding of All Major Branches of the Afro-Asiatic Language Tree in Ethiopia,
Including those that are not spoken elsewhere in the world, suggests that the HOMELAND of the Afro–Asiatic
Language family may have been somewhere close to Africa’s Southwestern
Ethiopia (Ehret 1995).
Since the land of Cush—the Son of Biblical Ham—is generally considered to be in the
Vicinity of the Ancient cities of Meroë and Napata, located in present-day Sudan.
Yet it should be stressed here that the split between the Cush*tic and
Semitic languages, branches of the Afro-Asiatic linguisticFamily, is Ancient,
Probably Predating the Holocene
(see, e.g., Militarev [2003]).
(The Holocene period is from 12,000 B.C)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene
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BIBLE ACCOUNTS: Gideons Holy Bible KING JAMES version)
{According to Bible Scholars the first 4 books in Genesis
Pertaining to the Founding of the Hebrew Nation are as follows}:
1.Genesis– Founding of the Hebrew Nation, 2. Exodus– the Covenant with the Hebrew Nation.
3. Leviticus– Laws of the Hebrew Nation. 4. Numbers– Journey to the Promise Land.
(Keep in mind according to)
1. GENESIS Chpt.10 Vs.6
And the Sons of Ham/Kham; Cush, Miz’ra-im, and Phut and Canaan.
Genesis Chpt.10 Vs.7
Cush’s (Ethiopia/Nubia) other sons were):
Seba, “Havilah”, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtecah
GENESIS Chpt. 13 Vs.1-2
And Abram went up out of EGYPT, He and his Wife,
And all that he had, And Lot with him, Into the SOUTH.
And Abrams was Very Rich in Cattle,
In Silver and in GOLD
GENESIS chpt. 16 Vs.1-2
Now Sa’rai Abram’s Wife Bare him No Children:
And she had a Hand Maid,
An Egyptian, Whose Name was Ha’gar.
And Sa’rai said unto Abram, Behold now the
Lord hath restrained me from
Bearing: I Pray thee, go in unto my Maid;
It may be that I obtain Children by Her.
And Abram Hearkened to the Voice of Sa’rai..
GENESIS Chpt.17 Vs. 15
And GOD said unto Ab-ra-ham As for
Sa’rai thy Wife, Thou Shalt not call Her name
Sa’rai, but Sarah shall be her Name be.
GENESIS Chpt. 25 Vs. 12
Now these are the Generations of Ish’ma-el,
Ab-rah-am’s Son, Whom Ha’gar the Egyptian, Sarah’s
Hand-maid, Bare unto Abraham
GENESIS Chpt. 25 Vs. 18
And they Dwelt from Hav’i–lah unto
Shur, That is before EGYPT, As Thou Goest Toward Assyria:
And he Died in the Presence of All his Breth-ren..
GENESIS Chpt. 37 Vs.25-28
(Vs.25)
And They Sat down to Eat Bread: And they lifted up their Eyes and looked, and
Behold , a Company of Ish’me–el–ites came from Gilead with their Camels bearing
Spicery and Balm and Myrrh, going to carry it DOWN to EGYPT
GENESIS Chpt. 50 Vs. 7-8 and Vs.26
(Vs.7-8)
And Joseph went up to Bury his Father:
And with him went up all the Servants of Pharaoh, The Elders of
His House, And All the
Elders of the Land of EGYPT
And All the House of Joseph and
His Brethren, and His Father’s House:
Only their little Ones, and their Flocks and thier Herds,
They Left in the Land of Goshen./Egypt
(Vs.26)
So Joseph Died, being a Hundred and Ten years Old:
And they Embalmed him, And he was put in a Coffin in Egypt.
2. ጥhe Book of Khamows/Amos: Chpt.9 Vs.7
Are ye not, as Children of the E-thi-o’pians unto me,
O‘ Children of Is-ra-el?
Saith the Lord”
Have not I brought up Israel, Out of the Land of Egypt ?
And from the Philistines of Caph’tor and the Syrians from Kir ?
(Philistines of Caph’tor is modern day Turkey via Syria)
3. I KINGS chpt.10 Vs.1 and 2
Vs.1 { And when the Queen of She’ba heard of the Fame of
Solomon Concerning the Name of the Lord,
She came to prove him with Hard Questions}
Vs.2 { And she came to Jeru’salem with a very Great Train, with
Camels that bare Spices and Very Much Gold,
and Precious stones: and when she was to come to Solomon,
She Communed with Him of all that was in her Heart}
4. I CHRONICLES
(First Book of the Chronology of Adam and the Hebrew Nation)
Chpt.1 Vs.1–4 and 8
{vs1. ADAM, Sheth, E’nosh, vs.2. Ke’nan, Ma-ha’la-le-el, Je’red}
{ vs.3. He’noch, Me-thu’se-lah and La’mech}
Lamech’s son and grandsons
{ vs.4 Noah, Shem, Ham and Ja’pheth.}
{vs.8 The Sons of Ham: Cush, and Miz’ra-im, Put and Canaan}
5. NUMBERS ch.12 Vs.1
And Miriam and Aaron Spake against Moses because
Of the E-thi-O’pi-an Woman whom he had Married:
For he had Married an E-thi-O’pi-an Woman.
6. HOSEA chpt.13 Vs. 4
Yet I am the Lord thy God from the Land of EGYPT, and thou shalt
Know no god but me: for there is no Saviour beside me.
7. Acts Chapter. 8 verse 26-27:
“Then the Angel of the Lord said to Philip, Start out and go South to the road that leads down from Jerusalem to Gaza, which is Desert.
“And he arose and went: And behold,
A Man of E-thi-o’pi-a, and Eunuch of Great Authority under Can-da-ce
Queen of E-thi-o’pi-ans, Who had the charge of all her Treasure, and had come to Jerusalem to Worship“.
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The State of Sheba mentioned in the Old Testament is believed to have been in Ethiopia , but is sometimes placed in Yemen.
The Axumite Kingdom is recorded once again as controlling part – if not all – of Yemen in the 6th century.
According to the Ethiopian legend, best represented in the Kebra Negest, the Queen of Sheba was tricked by
King Solomon into sleeping with him, Resulting in a child, named Ebn Melek (later Emperor Menelik I).
**The Tradition that the Biblical Queen of Sheba was a ruler of Ethiopia who visited
King Solomon in Jerusalem in Ancient Israel is Supported by the 1st century A.D. Jewish
Historian Flavius Josephus, who identified Solomon’s visitor as a
Queen of Egypt and Ethiopia.
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NOTE: The SONS of HAM Biblical Geography
CUSH– Location is Ethiopia/Nubia .
MIZ’RA-IM– Location is Ta-Merry/Egypt
PUT-Location is present day Libya.
CANAAN-Location is present day Is-ra’-el
Also keep in mind that according to Genesis 10:6,
Mizraim/Egypt was the Younger brother of
Cush/Ethiopia–Nubia and Elder brother of Phut/Libya and Israel/Canaan,
Whose Families together made up
the Hamite branch of Noah’s Descendants.
All Bible Dictionaries agree that the name “Ethiopia” in our English Old Testaments is ‘Cush’ in the Hebrew.
This is so, not only in the verse before us, but in every instance throughout the Old Testament.
The Truth is that the Hebrews called Ethiopia “Cush” in their own tongue.
But what has not been so well recognized is that the Hebrews used this name ‘Cush’ of more than one place.
The name is derived from Cush the Son of Ham, the son of
Noah, in Genesis 10:6.
In addition the word “Ethiopia” is a Greek word meaning “Burnt Faces.”
The Hebrew word Cush, translated as “Ethiopia,” was used in Biblical Times to refer to
“The Entire Nile Valley South of Egypt, including Nubia/Sudan and Abyssinia/Ethiopia”
(Edward Ullendorff, Ethiopia and the Bible, p. 5, quoted in The Sign and the Seal, p. 450).
http://nabataea.net/eden4.html
http://www.hope-of-israel.org/dynmoses.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopian_Empire
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15457403
http://www.ethiopiantreasures.toucansurf.com/pages/aksum.htm
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/nubia1.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_ethnic_divisions
Click to access 43026_Doron.pdf
http://books.google.ca/books?id=JY5Nt8_83r4C&pg=PA10&dq=philistim&lr=#v=onepage&q=philistim&f=false
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BOTANY:
In the Bible Genesis Chpt.2 Vs.12
(vs.12 And the the Gold of that Land is Good: there is Bdellium and the Onyx Stone).
Bdellium Trees are used to extract a reddish-brown resinous material, an dried sap of a number of trees,
But primarily from Commiphora Myrrha, otherwise known as Bdellium is
Native to Yemen, Somalia, the Eastern parts of E-thi-o’pi-a’s Horn of Africa.
Commiphora myrrha is a tree in the Burseraceae family.
Bdellium was an adulterant of the more “Costly” Myrrh
(Commiphora myrrha); guggul is still used as a binder in Perfumes.
In addition the word bedolach occurs twice in the Hebrew Bible.
They grow Exclusively in the Horn of Africa
(Djibouti, Ethiopia, Somalia, Northeast Kenya) and the Southern Arabian Peninsula
(Yemen, Oman) and Nowhere else in the World..
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/133259/
http://www.socyberty.com/History/The-History-of-Incense.332309
http://oneearthherbs.squarespace.com/important-herbs/myrrh-gum-commiphora-myrrha.html
http://www.worldagroforestrycentre.org/sea/products/afdbases/af/asp/SpeciesInfo.asp?SpID=17990
“Ancient Wine; The Search for the Origins of Viniculture” Patrick E. McGovern, 2003 ISBN 0-691-07080-6
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Mr. Archer you have not Referenced or Proved anything thus far
Explain Verses 11-12 in Genesis using your Carthage theory
Explain Pi’son which compasseth the Whole land of Havilah where there is
Gold, Onyx Stone and Bdellium which does Not grow in Tunisa/Carthage
Myrrh also known as Bdellium is a reddish-brown resinous material,
The dried sap of a number of trees, but primarily from
Commiphora myrrha, which is native to Yemen, Somalia, the Eastern parts of E-thi-o’pi-a.
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EGYPTIAN RECORDED ACCOUNTS:
We also have the First Documented Expedition to the land of Punt, from Ancient Egypt
Time period- (2487–2474 BC, 5th Dynasty) ~ or perhaps Earlier…
The earliest recorded Egyptian expedition to Punt was organized by Pharaoh Sahure Of the Fifth Dynasty (25th century BC) ~
Although GOLD from PUNT is recorded as having been in EGYPT in the time of King Khufu of the Fourth Dynasty of Egypt 2575 to 2467 BCE
PUNT apparently, also yielded a quantity of Costly
African MYRRH, GOLD, IVORY and BLACKWOOD etc..
(the land of Punt is the Horn of Africa location)
In Addition we have the Palermo Stone which also corroborates some of these events and also mentions
Expeditions to the Sinai and to the Exotic land of Punt,
As well as to The Diorite quarries northwest of Abu Simbel in Nubia.
The Mainstream view is that Punt was located to the South–East of Egypt,
Most likely on the Eastern Coast of the Horn of Africa.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palermo_stonestone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puntland
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myrrh
Land of Punt Map. click link below:
CHRONOLOGY of KUsh*tE–ASSYRIAN Struggle over JUDAH
734 B.C : Assyria (under Tiglath-pileser III) Invades
Philistia and advances as far as the Egyptian Border..
728 B.C : Kush (under Piye) conquers Lower Egypt then withdraws..
712 B.C. : Kush (under Shabaka) Re-Conquers All of Egypt..
701 B.C. : Assyria (under Sennacherib) Invades rebellious Phoenicia,
Phillistia, and Judah.
Kush*te Egypt (probably under joint rule of Pharaohs Shabaka and Shebitku) Confronts the
Assyrians before they can seize Jerusalem..
674 B.C. : Assyrian (under Esarhaddon) tries to Invade Egypt and is
Defeated by Kush*te–Egyptian forces under Taharqa..
667 B.C. : Assyria (under Assurbanipal) responds to Taharqa’s
Re-establishment of his Rule over Egypt by invading the Country. It conquers Thebes and
Drives Taharqa South..
664 B.C. : Taharqa dies and is succeded as Pharaoh of the 25th Dynasty
By his kinsman Tanwetamani. Meanwhile, Assyria establishes the Rival 26th Dynasty..
663 B.C. : Assyria ( under Assurbanipal) Pillages Thebes and Drives
The Kush*tes from Egypt Permanently...
586 B.C. : Babylon (under Nebuchadrezzar) re-conquers rebellious Jerusalem.
It Destroys the City and Forces Judah’s Leadership classes into Exile...
NOTE: University Libraries Devote Entire Shelves to Books that Deal with the period, the
So-Called “Era of the Hebrew Monarchy” – the time from the Late Eleventh Century A.D. to the
Early Sixth Century B.C. (1020 A.D.–586 B.C.)..
Reference from Henry T. Aubin’s: The Rescue of Jerusalem. 2002 Soho Press.
(The Alliance Between Hebrews and Africans in 701 B.C.)
Quebec Writers’ Federation Award Winner of 2002 Henry T. Aubin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_Writers%27_Federation_Awards
http://www.henryaubin.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabaka
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebitku
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taharqa
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Jerusalem
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EUROPEAN HISTORIAN ACCOUNTS: by African-Asiatic Authors
1. Diodorus of Sicily writes:
The E-thi-o’pi-ans say that the Egyptians are One of their Colonies
Which was brought into Egypt by Osirus.
They even allege that this country was origanally under Water,
But that the Nile, Dragging much mud as it Flowed from Ethiopia
Had finally filled it in and Made it part of the Continent…
They add that from them as from their Authors and Ancestors the
Egyptians get most of their Laws.
2. Herodutus the Greek historian states: The Egyptians said that they believed the
Colchians to be Descended from the Army of Sesostris. My own conjectures were
Founded, first, on the Fact that they were Black–Skinned and have Woolly Hair..
3. The Greek Historian Strabo mentioned the Importance of MIGRATIONS in
HISTORY and believing that this Particular Migration has proceeded from
Egypt to Ethiopia, remarks: Egyptians settled Ethiopia and Colchis
(colchis is located in modern day western georgia, near the black sea)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colchis
{excerpt from THE AFRICAN ORIGIN of Civilization by Cheikh Anta Diop}
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheikh_Anta_Diop
published in paris 1955 reprinted 1974 in usa
ETHIOPIA and THE ORIGIN of CIVILIZATION by John G. Jackson
Excerpt from pg.3
In discussing the Origin of Civilization in the Near East, Professor Charles Seignobos in his
History of Ancient Civilization, notes that the first civilized inhabitants of the Nile (Pi’son-Gi’hon) and
Tigris–Euphrates (Hid’de-kel and Euphrates) Valleys,
Were a Dark–Skinned People with Short Hair and Prominent Lips: and that they are referred to by Scholars as
Cush*tes (Ethiopians), and Hamites (Khamites) by Others..
John G. Jackson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_G._Jackson_(writer)
(ethiopia and the origin of civilization published in 1939)
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1E1-Seignobo.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_and_Judaism_in_the_African_diaspora
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AFTERWORD:
Trying to explain Eden in ancient Tunisia/Carthage may show some difficulties,
However the 5 points mentioned, must constitute a Plausible Designation..
1. Modern Genetics
2. Linguistics and Culture
3. Biblical Accounts
4. Geography and Hydrology
5. Botany~note: (is a branch of biology and is the scientific study of plant life and development.)
* Egyptian/Kemetic Recorded accounts
** European Historian accounts
Please Post your References and Citations to Disprove my Claims..