4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (2024)

by Teresa Perleberg | Jan 12, 2016 | 68 comments

  1. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (1)

    Patricia Milleron December 1, 2021 at 7:27 pm

    Hello! I am just getting started. I’m trying to read everything I can while I wait for my Sheep kit. I feel calmer just reading about needle felting. So therefore I am looking forward to actual needle felting being kind of a meditation! Haha I guess you can’t get too relaxed or that’s when you may find a needle in your finger. Anyway I am anxiously awaiting my kit and cannot hardly stand it!!! I just want to say thank you to all who share tips, ideas and experience here.

  2. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (2)

    Janet fryeron February 18, 2020 at 12:26 pm

    This is a wonderful site and I am very tempted to join your academy ! I am a year into the joys ( and frustration ) of self taught needle felting . Having practiced wood and clay sculpture , adapting this material is fascinating ( and much cleaner ) . My visions for my creations are more human than animal with long limbs , clay hands feet and faces , an armature is pretty essential for the “ poses” and the flexibility I hope to achieve and , generally , I work only in core wool . I do find the wire to be a nuisance so in some cases where the felt is “ fat “ enough I felt the body parts then using a pointed thin ( as possible ) knitting needle I force a channel through the felt then pass my wire through this , then link the arms and legs to the body ? Don’t know if this concept helps anyone else out there ….

  3. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (3)

    Elaineon October 22, 2018 at 3:29 am

    I’m just starting out on a new journey – needle felting:
    It’s exciting but don’t know which way to start:
    To begin a landscape do I begin on a felt sheet ?

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (4)

      Annieon May 20, 2019 at 1:12 am

      I needle felt pictures onto any surface that will allow the needles through (linen, felt etc.) I don’t do wet felting, so all my backgrounds are felted, then I use a multi needle tool to make sure all the background fibres are firmly fixed. I would say for someone starting out, felt would be a good medium to use, or experiment with scraps of linen and wool. Enjoy your journey!!

  4. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (5)

    June Parkeron October 19, 2018 at 5:43 am

    Hi Teresa, I subscribed to your newsletter, and not sure if I downloaded your free book. Could you please let me know. Thanks.

  5. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (6)

    haritobin35on March 6, 2018 at 12:05 am

    I saw a photo of a felter on Pinterest, and behind her, her wool was in a clear plastic hanging shoe holder (the one that has a pocket to hold each shoe separately). If I had space , I think this looked like a great idea. Right now, I keep bins with separate colors but have to dump the wool out to see what I want to use. If anyone has any suggestions, that would be great.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (7)

      Kellieon April 23, 2018 at 4:34 pm

      I use old hard sided suitcases to store my wool roving and batts. A different case for each color. A blue case for blues, brown case for Brown’s etc. They work well as the wool stays in place, they are portable and easily stacked, and you can store your foam, needles, eyes and other supplies in the pocket. When you open them you can see everything, and it keeps the moths out.

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (8)

        Teresa Perlebergon April 23, 2018 at 4:50 pm

        I love this idea Kellie! Thank you so much for sharing it.

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (9)

        Vicki Basson May 6, 2018 at 10:11 am

        I really like your idea of using old hard wood sided suitcases for organizing. May I ask what size of suitcase you use?

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (10)

      Kim Grotleon November 16, 2018 at 7:16 pm

      I have a stackable Christmas ornament box from JoAnn Fabrics- adjustable dividers, as many layers as you need (you can buy multiple boxes and stack them). I have a small version for tools, eyes, needles etc. These are spectacularly useful.

  6. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (11)

    Name *vivian tamara macfadem juarezon January 12, 2018 at 9:39 am

    oi Teresa,adorei as dicas e também sou uma iniciante,gulosa em aprender,gosto de fazer bichinhos para minhas bonecas waldor e estou começando a fazer suas roupinhas e sapatos em feltragem molhada adoro trabalhar com fibras,bjinhos e obrigado

  7. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (12)

    Lisa B.on November 13, 2017 at 4:41 pm

    I am extremely new to needle felting. I started out trying to make little balls to attach to acorn caps. I made three balls the perfect size and now I made two that are too big. Is there a way to pull the roving out of the needle felted ball to make it smaller, or should I just put it aside to use in another project later? Thank you very much for your great tips. I am using the leather finger covers as I am sure I would destroy my hands, plus I have lymphedema in my left arm which I use to hold the roving while I needle felt. I don’t need any unnecessary injuries. I am really looking forward to perhaps making a felted snowman for the holidays. But that will have to come after I am better at felting. I am so glad I found your site.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (13)

      Teresa Perlebergon November 20, 2017 at 10:14 am

      Hi Lisa,
      Always start smaller than you think, you can always make it bigger but not smaller.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (14)

      Maryon November 30, 2017 at 9:13 pm

      Maybe turn them into charms, earnings, or a pendant? Or create some critters that need a snack. 😉

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (15)

      Pennyon November 30, 2020 at 4:44 pm

      Why not make another set of acorns using the bigger balls? Just make bigger caps to fit them, and use them in a completely different arrangement/display, keeping them separated from your original “little acorns”, so there’s no size difference comparison. Or use them for heads for an animal, or, or…..??? I have a lot of eggs and balls set aside from failed projects, but they can still be used for making something new!

  8. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (16)

    Kathyon October 7, 2017 at 1:46 pm

    So glad I came upon your site! Gotta love Pinterest! GREAT info.
    I am just discovering felting & very interested. Haven’y started it yet, so coming across your site is PERFECT because I didn’t even know where to start 🙂

  9. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (17)

    zhentup53on August 25, 2017 at 6:13 pm

    I am hooked (or should I say “needled”) with this craft! I had my doubts if I would be able to handle the wool. Growing up here in Maine, I have been exposed to wool all my life and have had problems of a blistery rash. When knitting, I have to be very careful of yarn content because most yarns create a problem. Recently, I purchased a few kits from you and am currently making my first sheep. I’m not having a bit of irritation with the roving. I was wondering if you’ve heard anything like this before. Possibly the breed of sheep, or some kind of processing in making it into yarn. I also have the problem with Alpaca, when knitting.

    I’m clueless, but glad I’m having such good luck. Thanks so much for the idea of using a pen as a needle holder! I happen to have a pen fetish and have a nice collection of well padded pens. Why not take advantage of someone else’s design for comfort, rather than just toss it?!?

    -Leanne, Maine

  10. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (18)

    Jason sayeron May 3, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    Good evening Teresa
    I’m looking at trying to start this great craft having never done this before, and feel blessed to have found this blog.. as there is no one near where I live ( Clacton on sea…England) that teaches this… so I’m trying to go it alone , I’m either crazy or brave.. trying to find what I need to buy to start on my journey, and reading this page makes me feel like I’m not on my own.. enjoying all your tips, I have signed up for your newsletter and will down load your ebook..
    Many thanks jason.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (19)

      Teresa Perlebergon May 3, 2017 at 3:31 pm

      So glad to hear you found this helpful Jason! I hope you find many more helpful article here and in my newsletter.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (20)

      Cory Granton July 1, 2017 at 7:27 am

      if you haven’t yet then join the academy! I’m a beginner too and she has some amazing videos and projects and all the help you need!

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (21)

        Tina Evanson February 25, 2018 at 12:33 pm

        How do you join?
        I’m a beginner too. I’ve been ordering things but have yet to start.
        Any help is gratefully accepted.

        • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (22)

          Teresa Perlebergon February 25, 2018 at 1:35 pm

          Hi Tina,
          I would love to have you in the Academy. Find out more about the Bear Creek Needle Felting Academy here:

          https://bearcreekfelting.com/teresa-perlebergs-needle-felting-academy/

          Just copy and past the url into your browser or click on “home” above to be taken to the home page and you will see information on the Academy.

  11. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (23)

    Natalie Hulme Leachon April 16, 2017 at 11:43 am

    Hi. You have mentioned using wet felting techniques with your needle felting? Could you clarify please? At what stage would you do this? Am very interested.
    Many thanks,
    Natalie

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (24)

      Teresa Perlebergon April 26, 2017 at 9:36 am

      Thank you for asking. I use wet felting at various stages in my needle felting process. It would be difficult to explain how I do it in this reply. What I do offer is a membership community called The Needle Felting Academy. In the community you have access to variety of needle felting courses that I am adding to all the time. The courses range from beginner to advanced. I also share all my tips, techniques and secrets as well as chat with you and answer questions in the forums. If you would like to find out more, here is a link that will give you more information:

      https://bearcreekfelting.com/teresa-perlebergs-needle-felting-academy/

  12. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (25)

    ROSEMARIE GRANTon March 26, 2017 at 6:01 pm

    I am a beginner and am having a problem knowing what needle size I am working with. I try to see if it is the shape of the picture but can’t seem to see the difference between them. Also, I live in Alaska and order my wool on line or pick some up whenever I am on a trip to the lower 48. This has left me with pits of this and that and I would like to know how to store my colors in a way that is easy to find. Please help me or point me in the right direction. I signed up for your news letter today, and am looking forward to all your tips. Thank you for your help

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (26)

      Teresa Perlebergon March 27, 2017 at 9:36 am

      I try to store my needles in the same place after I use them so that I remember what size they are. I also mark them with fingernail polish or use different holders for them. It is hard to figure out what size they are just by looking at them, I’m not able to do it. If I am unsure I will see how they felt, but this doesn’t always work as they may be worn out already. Hope this helps!

      Storing all the wool is still a work in progress for me! I have tried many different ways and right now all the different colors and types are rolled in little balls in a shallow drawer, where I can see them all. If they are a different breed I keep them in a bag with a tag saying what they are. It is very hard keeping it all organized. I would love to here what others do! Maybe I will write a blog post and see what others do as well. Stay tuned! Thanks for joining my email newsletter, I hope you find it helpful!
      Teresa

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (27)

        Tracie Lon September 8, 2018 at 1:46 am

        I store my wool in clear plastic containers I get at the local dollar store. I have one for each “group” of colors (1 for red, 1 for blue, etc….) They stack well, you can see the colors through them, and they come in enough sizes you can easily find the right size for the varying amounts of wool. Plus they keep the wool clean. I also use a few to transport the wool I need when working on a project away from home. I have a large craft table I work on, and they stack up along the back so that I can easily reach and use the ones I need.

        • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (28)

          Mistyon September 8, 2018 at 7:04 am

          What a great idea, Tracie! Being able to get to your materials really adds to the enjoyment of felting. Thanks for sharing!

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (29)

        Christineon August 4, 2019 at 3:15 pm

        I store my wool in clear, stackable, plastic shoe boxes.

  13. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (30)

    janette bankson January 3, 2017 at 5:35 am

    I have just found this page.my hands are crippled with arthritis.And read a lot of people use wire ,which im unable to use.very happy to have found this blog,so helpfull.

  14. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (31)

    Susanon November 15, 2016 at 7:08 pm

    I just got into felting and i am now addicted to it. I also felt very solid but the problem i come across is while i am handling my item it starts to get tiny balls (like sweaters get Pilling) does anyone have this problem and how fix it.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (32)

      Teresa Perlebergon November 15, 2016 at 7:11 pm

      I have never had this problem. What kind of wool are you using?

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (33)

        Susanon November 16, 2016 at 1:49 am

        The wool is extra fine merino.
        I think this is the first time I have used this for a whole top coat.

        • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (34)

          Teresa Perlebergon November 16, 2016 at 6:06 am

          I would try out different kinds of wool and see if you continue to have this problem.

  15. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (35)

    Johannaon November 5, 2016 at 10:51 pm

    Great tips. I use upholstery foam too. I like your core idea with the felted wool. I too have sheep. What I use for core wool is southdown that my shearer sells to me after he has them made into batts. It isn’t great quality stuff but almost packs itself for a tight core. I do run out though and I also teach a lot with young ones and the ball idea would work well. I make my dryer balls that way. The pen idea is good too. I have a needle holder I like for one needle but I plan to try it. When I work with kids I use bits of dowel and masking tape a needle to it. The pen idea would take some collecting but sounds really fine notional. I love your animals! The moose is spectacular.

  16. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (36)

    Di Summitton June 2, 2016 at 12:43 pm

    Thank you for all the wonderful tips, I look forward to your upcoming tips and tutorials.

  17. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (37)

    Jane Kintzion April 9, 2016 at 7:48 pm

    Do you have any experience adding weights (some sort of mystery beads that feel like Beanie Baby style weights) to your felted sculptures? I saw some at a craft show and they “sat” better than just a wool core. I’d love some suggestions. Love your beautiful work!

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (38)

      Teresaon April 9, 2016 at 8:46 pm

      Hi Jane,
      I haven’t used weights in my sculptures, but I have heard that some do. My sculptures are usually felted to be very solid and so I haven’t had the need to look into it. Sorry I’m not much help in this area. Thanks for asking though.
      Teresa

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (39)

      JUDITH A PANUSHKAon January 1, 2019 at 6:35 pm

      I put a small rock in a bunny’s butt for weight…. the needle didn’t like it, but it worked!

  18. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (40)

    Kim Stockdaleon March 22, 2016 at 12:01 pm

    I really enjoyed the tips. I’m learning as much as I can to improve my technique.

  19. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (41)

    Allisonon March 4, 2016 at 7:19 pm

    Thank you for your tips ,I have only started to needle felt and found them very helpfull.

  20. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (42)

    LeslieSeeseon March 2, 2016 at 6:53 am

    I like your pen idea and many other ideas. I have been teaching beginning needle felting classes for a year and find so many of your points exactly in line with my opening information.
    Each new session starts in a different season so I start woth something simple, pumpkin in October/November, Snowman in December, hearts in Jan/Feb. Now in April I will work on flowers and birds. I will be listing your site in my references. Have you done flat felting? I use the term, painting with wool. I am curious to se if you have done anything besides animals. Also wonder if you have a trick for standing up figured on 2 legs?

  21. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (43)

    Debraon February 22, 2016 at 10:05 pm

    Great tips. I especially like the needle in the pen tip. Why didn’t I think of that. This will really help arthritic hands.

  22. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (44)

    Stephanieon February 20, 2016 at 12:00 am

    I love your site! What a blessing to find. I’m now a beginner and loving this wool roving. Do you happen to know where I can get about 2 pounds of wool for a very low price?
    Thank you

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (45)

      Teresaon March 2, 2016 at 10:26 pm

      I would try Etsy.

  23. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (46)

    Suzanneon February 11, 2016 at 10:27 am

    I’m just about to make myself a burlap & rice bag cushion to use instead of foam for needle felting. Have you tried this & if so, do you have any comment?

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (47)

      Teresaon February 11, 2016 at 10:48 am

      Hi Suzanne, I have not tried using a burlap and rice bag cushion. I would be curious to know what you think after using it!
      Thanks,
      Teresa

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (48)

        Cory Granton July 1, 2017 at 7:22 am

        I love the rice and burlap! i just started so I dont have much to compare to but I like it a lot!

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (49)

      Patsyon April 3, 2018 at 1:31 pm

      I did the burlap bag and the needle broke down the fibers of the burlap. Within a few uses I had rice pouring out. Now I lay a piece of burlap iver my foam which makes it easy to lift the piece away from the foam and I change it out for different colors if wool. That cuts back on unwanted color mixing.

  24. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (50)

    Teresaon January 25, 2016 at 11:54 am

    Thanks Genie! I haven’t had a lot of issues with fibers staying in my foam. I can usually just pick out the fibers or switch sides for different colors.

  25. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (51)

    Terry Weberon January 25, 2016 at 8:28 am

    Just a thought, I’ve been using armatures (pipe cleaners really) for several years with no problem. My tip is: I use wool yarn I’ve picked up cheap at garage sales to wind around the armature several times to make my base to felt on. So the first half inch of figure is wool yarn which makes it easier to felt the wool into. I use this instead of core wool I guess. My figures have more heft and solidness because of this. I also use the natural wool to shape the figure and just use my colored wool for the end “coat”. I also like taking my “too dirty ” to use wool and toss in the washer. They make wonderful dreadlocks for my sheep!

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (52)

      Teresaon January 25, 2016 at 11:51 am

      Thank you for the tips Terry. I haven’t figured out why a full body wire armature is necessary. I would think even if you wrap yarn around the wire you will still run into the wire with your needle. I am glad it works for you, and apparently many others, but I haven’t justified the headache of working with it in the first place. I wrap the wool roving around the wire when doing legs to have something to work with at the start. Not very much, so as to have room to sculpt. Thanks for the other tips as well!
      Teresa

  26. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (53)

    Pennyon January 25, 2016 at 6:54 am

    I have been needlefelting for years and it’s always nice to find out how others tackle things! I agree with you about armatures. I am currently tackling the first thing I have ever made over an armature (it’s a human form which needs to be pose-able) and it’s driving me crazy! I keep on stabbing the wire so it’s taking forever. I’m beginning to think it would be easier to start again and just make it extra firm.

  27. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (54)

    Karenon January 23, 2016 at 4:34 pm

    Wonderful tips, Thankyou! I am new to needlefelting and really appreciate your ideas.

  28. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (55)

    frede humphreyson January 23, 2016 at 1:08 pm

    thanks for the good advice, I need to learn more as I felt more

  29. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (56)

    Carol VanBruaeneon January 22, 2016 at 12:55 pm

    Thank you so much for your blog and great info! My name is Carol a beginner at needle felting and having so much fun . Not sure if I am doing things right , but pleased with the look I have made a sheep, baby duck,and small bird. Gave a gift of a sheep to a friend for a Christmas ornimant they loved it ! But I want to learn more ! Have not found anyone to work with, just been following tutorials and pictures,I fell hooked on it,,find myself felting ever time I sit down. Would like to stay with you as long as I can to continue to learn more . Thank you again Carol

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (57)

      Teresaon January 22, 2016 at 1:16 pm

      I am glad you found me Carol! I learned by trial and error and if things are looking good and you are having fun you are on the right track. If you have specific questions let me know. I am always looking for ways to help others with this wonderful art form.

  30. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (58)

    Chrison January 22, 2016 at 11:21 am

    I found your tip about wool balls really helpful and yes it does save a lot of work and money. Many thanks.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (59)

      Teresaon January 22, 2016 at 11:33 am

      I am happy to hear that! I know it made a big difference for me.

  31. 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (60)

    Karenon January 12, 2016 at 11:51 pm

    I have seen felting kits with leather fingers to protect fingers from stabs of the needles. Have you ever tried these?

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (61)

      Teresaon January 13, 2016 at 7:56 am

      I have never tried the leather finger covers. I think they would be awkward to work with. I don’t stab myself with the needle as much as I used to, my fingers have learned on their own to stay out of the way. 🙂

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (62)

      Ali Wraggon October 15, 2016 at 11:42 am

      Hi, I regularly use leather finger guards and find them indespensible! Once you’ve got used to having them on your fingers, they’re only used on the hand that’s holding the project so don’t really get in the way. They’ve saved my fingers many times, I wouldn’t be without them!

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (63)

        haritobin35on August 19, 2017 at 2:03 pm

        Would you mind telling me where you got the covers that work…I ordered some on Amazon and the needle went right through

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (64)

      haritobin35on August 19, 2017 at 2:02 pm

      I’ve just started and was destroying the fingers on my left hand. I ordered a kit with plastic covers, and they saved my life. I then ordered separate leathers covers , but they did not stop the needle from stabbing my fingers, so please be careful what you order.

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (65)

      Annon December 6, 2017 at 9:35 pm

      Do you have any suggestions as to how I can find pros to learn from? I don’t feel confident teaching myself or just using YouTube tutorials. I’d love a real live teacher!

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (66)

        Teresa Perlebergon December 8, 2017 at 8:46 pm

        I have designed needle felting kits, you can find them here: https://bearcreekfelting.com/product-category/needlefeltingkits/ or join the Bear Creek Needle Felting Academy here:
        https://bearcreekfelting.com/teresa-perlebergs-needle-felting-academy/

    • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (67)

      Marie Thomassonon January 20, 2018 at 4:25 pm

      Karen, I’ve never used the finger protectors but have found a small tool by Clover that is a light green, measures about 6″ and has what looks like a fine wire rake at one end that I have had great success with. I only use it when I’m doing something really tiny (like a carrot nose for a snowman) which is when I found I would be more prone to stabbing my fingers. Good luck and happy felting.

      • 4 Needle Felting Secrets to Save you Time, Money and Headaches (68)

        Tracey Templeon March 18, 2019 at 10:08 am

        I never use the finger protectors because i worry i would be heavier handed with the needle thinking i was safe. I have learned to be more careful of my fingers lol!

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